| Archive for Tagpoker Forum A friendly place for winning poker players to share their strategy to making money playing poker. |
| butitwassooted |
On learning PLO, from scratch to HUPLO cashSo after +- 230K hands of NLH (mostly 6m cash) I'm getting kinda bored with it, even though I still have plenty leaks and room to improve. The winrates atm are also fine, its just getting kinda stale. HU the same, plus even at 100NL the lobby's are an absolute joke, not really looking forward to camping at 10 tables to get action.So PLO it is, first 6m to get the basics down, I'll figure out the rest while destroying loldonks hu. Action plan: - Installed HEM Omaha, instantly seeing the equity you had on different streets alone is invaluable. - First studying the DC series Hellomaha, Solid State PLO & 2x6 (all 6m series) - play a bunch of 6m while studying, clearing aff. kickbacks while doing it (the rake at micro's is insane) - after I have the basics down (and hopefully more) play a bunch of HUPLO sng's - Watch ghost vids of HUPLO players - sit at a HUPLO50 table - wait for a donk - ... - ? - profit! at least that's the plan for now. Im going to track progress in here, from scratch to huplo cash. I will post fun hands, share my experience, and eventually sick graffs. |
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| butitwassooted |
Played couple sessions 10 & 25plo 6m at Merge, tables are full of 82/2/0 lol. Already learned the hard way that punishing the limpers doesn't really work in plo, and the tables also don't really lend themselves to stealing the blinds.
Even though I don't really know what I'm doing , donks are donks, so I'm already exploiting them hardcore in obvious spots. But I'm running at 38/29/8, so I have to tone my ranges down just a tad I think. As long as my opponents think that if they hold the naked ace they have a nutflushdraw, and that a 7 high flush is the nuts... after the board pairs on the T all should be good. Getting it in with 66% 3way is always nice, quadding up even more so. Full Tilt, $0.05/$0.10 PL Omaha Cash Game, 6 Players UTG: $10 MP: $9.89 Hero (CO): $12.81 BTN: $13.88 SB: $18.96 BB: $21.34 Pre-Flop: J  T J 7 dealt to Hero (CO)
2 folds, Hero raises to $0.30, BTN calls $0.30, SB calls $0.25, BB folds Flop: ($1) J  4 Q (3 Players)
SB checks, Hero bets $0.85, BTN calls $0.85, SB raises to $4.40, Hero raises to $12.51 and is All-In, BTN calls $11.66, SB raises to $18.66 and is All-In, BTN calls $1.07 and is All-In Turn: ($40.67) J (3 Players - 1 is All-In)
River: ($40.67) 2 (3 Players - 1 is All-In)
Results: $40.67 Pot ($2 Rake) Hero showed J T J 7 and WON $36.53 (+$23.72 NET)
BTN showed Q 3 K 3 and LOST (-$13.88 NET)
SB showed A 8 A 6 and WON $2.14 (-$11.69 NET)
Donks are gonna donk. Most obvious inducespot ever: Merge, $0.05/$0.10 PL Omaha Cash Game, 5 Players BB: $9.50 UTG: $10.61 Hero (CO): $14.57 BTN: $20.71 SB: $24.28 Pre-Flop: A 8 T 9 dealt to Hero (CO)
UTG folds, Hero raises to $0.35, BTN calls $0.35, SB calls $0.30, BB calls $0.25 Flop: ($1.40) 9 T 8 (4 Players)
SB checks, BB checks, Hero bets $1.40, BTN calls $1.40, 2 folds Turn: ($4.20) 2 (2 Players)
Hero bets $4.20, BTN calls $4.20 River: ($12.60) 3 (2 Players)
Hero checks, BTN bets $12.60, Hero calls $8.62 and is All-In Results: $29.84 Pot ($1.49 Rake) Hero showed A 8 T 9 and WON $28.35 (+$13.78 NET)
BTN showed K 6 Q 9 and LOST (-$14.57 NET)
I do not know what he had. I do know it was not a nine, and that he was looking for an excuse to fold. The openlimp must have been a misclick. Merge, $0.10/$0.25 PL Omaha Cash Game, 6 Players BTN: $10.97 SB: $33.42 BB: $39 Hero (UTG): $36.94 MP: $7.25 CO: $26.27 Pre-Flop: J Q 6 T dealt to Hero (UTG)
Hero calls $0.25, 2 folds, BTN calls $0.25, SB raises to $1.25, BB folds, Hero calls $1, BTN calls $1 Flop: ($4) 9 J 4 (3 Players)
SB bets $2, Hero calls $2, BTN folds Turn: ($  9 (2 Players)
SB bets $2, Hero raises to $7, SB calls $5 River: ($22) T (2 Players)
SB checks, Hero bets $22, SB folds Results: $22 Pot Hero showed J Q 6 T and WON $42.90 (+$32.65 NET)
Up a couple stacks, not really noteworthy. Been watching Hellomaha, perfect for people just starting with plo. I'm having lots of fun, and I'm halfway convinced that reading opponent types and obvious betsizing/timing tells alone is enough to be close to breakeven here, but no way to tell of course. |
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| Wannawin |
interested t osee how you get on with this as well. FGL | ||||||
| BetMagicMoney |
GL GL would be very intrested in your results 
I've played some PLO HUSNGs and they were super soft with people having no idea what they were doing 
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| nachtwacht |
first of all, gl on the BR build !
Thats not realy true... it actualy works very well but you have to know what is happening. In PLO edges are a lot smaller. But if you for instance have a good rundown and you have 4 limpers, you know you have the biggest pre flop equity. Therefore, putting money in at that point, and having all limpers call your raise, is great because you are sure to have the biggest equity at that point. Thats why I think it works very well.... you just don't see it immediatly in your bankroll because it also introduces more variance... wich can be painfull at times. Especialy with the smaller edges, it's just easier for the coin to fall the other way a few times in a row
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| butitwassooted |
Well, you probably mean ''handequities run closer together in PLO''? As the achievable winrates are actually higher. And I meant it more as in ''fck those limpers, I have the button, lets blast it up and take down the dead money''. As, like to 3B's, noone ever folds. Of course you still raise everything that can flop strong, just not crap. Its all about postflop playability, setting up desirable SPR's, drawing to the nuts, freerolling, having redraws, and ''smoothing out your equitydistributions''. Or so they say. |
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| nachtwacht |
Yes, thats what I tried to say indeed
That was indeed what I assumed you were saying wich is indeed an impossibility in PLO They have 4 cards, ofcourse they stick around
Damn... reading your posting about it I start missing it right away. Been a long time since I played it. |
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| ottocat01 |
Looking forward to seeing the results of this. Please keep us posted. Omaha is a great game and I think it makes you better at all other forms of poker. | ||||||
| butitwassooted |
Thanks for the interest guys, I'll try to keep it updated with fun hands and observations.
This chap still had 24% equity on the F, eventhough I had his BDFD dominated. Merge, $0.10/$0.25 PL Omaha Cash Game, 5 Players BB: $26.97 UTG: $20.67 Hero (CO): $66.77 BTN: $22.13 SB: $23.09 Pre-Flop: 6 Q A A dealt to Hero (CO)
UTG calls $0.25, Hero raises to $1.10, 2 folds, BB calls $0.85, UTG calls $0.85 Flop: ($3.40) A 7 T (3 Players)
BB bets $1.70, UTG folds, Hero raises to $7.23, BB raises to $25.09, Hero raises to $42.95, BB calls $0.78 and is All-In Turn: ($55.14) 3 (2 Players - 1 is All-In)
River: ($55.14) 2 (2 Players - 1 is All-In)
Results: $55.14 Pot ($2 Rake) BB showed 6 8 7 7 and LOST (-$26.72 NET)
Hero showed 6 Q A A and WON $53.14 (+$26.17 NET)
Why yes sir, that is on fine flush you flopped there. Just a cooler, nothing you can do. Merge, $0.05/$0.10 PL Omaha Cash Game, 5 Players CO: $27.47 BTN: $10.47 SB: $13.99 Hero (BB): $18.45 UTG: $8.33 Pre-Flop: 4 9 A T dealt to Hero (BB)
UTG raises to $0.35, CO calls $0.35, 2 folds, Hero calls $0.25 Flop: ($1.10) 8 3 9 (3 Players)
Hero checks, UTG bets $1.10, CO folds, Hero calls $1.10 Turn: ($3.30) Q (2 Players)
Hero checks, UTG bets $3.30, Hero raises to $13.20, UTG calls $3.58 and is All-In River: ($17.06) K (2 Players - 1 is All-In)
Results: $17.06 Pot ($0.85 Rake) Hero showed 4 9 A T and WON $16.21 (+$7.98 NET)
UTG showed 2 6 A Q and LOST (-$8.33 NET)
Riveting blocker bro, but I'm just not good enough to fold the second nuts. Not yet anyway... IPoker, $0.10/$0.20 PL Omaha Cash Game, 5 Players BB: $18.90 UTG: $112.82 CO: $39.13 Hero (BTN): $19 SB: $35.78 Pre-Flop: K K 2 5 dealt to Hero (BTN)
UTG folds, CO raises to $0.70, Hero calls $0.70, SB folds, BB calls $0.50 Flop: ($2.20) 6 T Q (3 Players)
BB checks, CO checks, Hero bets $2, BB calls $2, CO folds Turn: ($6.20) 8 (2 Players)
BB checks, Hero bets $4.65, BB raises to $16.20 and is All-In, Hero calls $11.55 River: ($38.60) 4 (2 Players - 1 is All-In)
Results: $38.60 Pot ($1.93 Rake) BB showed Q T A J and LOST (-$18.70 NET)
Hero showed K K 2 5 and WON $36.67 (+$17.77 NET)
Watched a couple of hellomaha & 2x6 vids while 2 tabling, good stuff in there. |
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| butitwassooted |
Meh I think I'm done for a while.
My keyboard broke (no, not related to the graph lol) so I'll post some hands/observations later when I don't have to type using a onscreen keyboard. |
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| butitwassooted |
I'm looking for someone to play some HUSNG matches and exchange notes/tips/HH/recorded matches/sweat sessions/whatever.
So if anybody has at least some experience in PLO/HUPLO, and wants to join me in the quest for 30bb/100 winrates, shoot me a PM. We can play on FTP, Entraction, Ipoker, Prima, or Everleaf. I'm not really looking for someone that wants to try it sometime for fun, but experienced NLH players that want to transition to HUPLO. |
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| butitwassooted |
LOL Swongz. This is all HU:
I've started a group at http://www.pokerstudygroups.com/group/there-will-be-flips With a forum and screensharing built in and everything. Join me if you want to flip your way up the stakes. |
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| FunkMastah |
bet U will get used to these.
I've seen so many HUplo graphs and they all are more or less swingy. Last one was one finnish guy who basically plays PLOhu $25/50 and $50/100. He had a solid winning month until 25th day. Then he lost $120k in 2000 hands and grinded it back in next 2 days. That's just sick, and the variance is bigger when u get higher. |
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| butitwassooted |
I cant stop laughing at this one. So much greatness. Note the L3B pre.
IPoker, $0.05/$0.10 PL Omaha Cash Game, 2 Players Hero (BB): $15.77 BTN: $9.93 Pre-Flop: A 6 J A dealt to Hero (BB)
BTN calls $0.05, Hero raises to $0.30, BTN raises to $0.85, Hero raises to $2.50, BTN calls $1.70 Flop: ($5.20) 8 4 T (2 Players)
Hero bets $2.90, BTN raises to $7.33 and is All-In, Hero calls $4.43 Turn: ($19.86) 5 (2 Players - 1 is All-In)
River: ($19.86) 4 (2 Players - 1 is All-In)
Results: $19.86 Pot ($1 Rake) Hero showed A 6 J A and LOST (-$9.83 NET)
BTN showed 3 8 8 8 and WON $18.86 (+$8.98 NET)
I also liked this one. Thanks for messing up my AIEV line champ. IPoker, $0.05/$0.10 PL Omaha Cash Game, 2 Players Hero (BTN): $11.45 BB: $10.05 Pre-Flop: T K 9 A dealt to Hero (BTN)
Hero raises to $0.30, BB calls $0.20 Flop: ($0.60) T K 8 (2 Players)
BB checks, Hero bets $0.60, BB raises to $1.50, Hero calls $0.90 Turn: ($3.60) 6 (2 Players)
BB bets $1.50, Hero raises to $8.10, BB calls $6.60 River: ($19.80) J (2 Players)
BB bets $0.15 and is All-In, Hero calls $0.15 Results: $20.10 Pot ($1 Rake) Hero showed T K 9 A and LOST (-$10 NET)
BB showed 6 K J A and WON $19.10 (+$9.15 NET)
How's this? 
A 12 or 24 bi swing? That is standard in a aggro match, where you often get deep fast. Have you ever seen Isildur play? A couple weeks ago he was 140K+ deep. On 5 out of 6 $25/50 6max tables. lol.
variance is unrelated to the stakes, but is a product of winrate and standard deviation. So the more equally skilled, and the more aggro, the higher the variance. If you hardcore bumhunt loosepassive loldonks, not so much. |